Unlocking the Secrets of Infinite Banking with Jared Aversano

[00:00:01] Speaker A: Hello. Welcome to the Money Adjustment. I'm your host, Dr. Marc Kramer, D.C. i am a chiropractor who loves investing and trading. Are you interested in what's moving markets and your money? Great. Me, too. Let's get started. If you're listening to a podcast called the Money Adjustment, I have to assume that there's something inside of you that wants to adjust something to make more money. So, like my own personal journey, my Adjustment is like, you use the terms going from a thousandaire to millionaire to a billionaire. If you have higher aspirations, then you're going to look at opportunities like these. [00:00:46] Speaker B: Now, this is where life insurance gets sexy. [00:00:50] Speaker A: Yeah, I'm excited. All right, Jared Aversano. Just let me know if I'm pronouncing your name correctly here. Jared Aversano. [00:01:02] Speaker B: You can call me whatever you want. Just don't call me late to dinner. [00:01:05] Speaker A: Yeah, I got you on that. I just want to. If I'm going to say your name, I want to make sure I'm saying it correctly. Jared Aversano. [00:01:11] Speaker B: Yup. [00:01:12] Speaker A: Aversano. Okay. Aversano. All right. So I start with my warmup just to get myself in the zone. It's kind of like an anchor for me. So I'll jump on that. Then I'm probably gonna ramble for about, I don't know, hopefully less than five minutes. So it's gonna be my thinking in terms of how we got to this point in us having a conversation, and then we'll jump into allowing you an opportunity to present your case. Okay. Not it. Not in a challenging type way, but in a. Like, legitimately. I'm curious, because I'm interested in all things investing and all right. So I just wanted to let you know all that. Give you some preface for that. I wanted to record a little bit of something before I had you on, because I've never spoken to you before. This is actually our first time talking together and even connecting outside of just sending messages and things like that. And so I want to kind of prep the audience for how we got here. Just so you know, I did a little bit of preparation on my own. I reviewed Garrett Gunderson's book what Would the Rockefellers Do? Because that's what I remember when I was investigating this on my own a number of years back. So with that said, you're gonna hear me kind of go into it like the audience is listening, and I'll find an opportunity to have you jump in, and I'll queue you in. Okay. Works. [00:02:32] Speaker B: I'm in. [00:02:32] Speaker A: You're Good, you're here. You're ready to go. I know you're good. [00:02:34] Speaker B: I'm in. [00:02:36] Speaker A: I know people in the Grant Cardone community are ready to go, which is why I love it. Today's guest I have not spoken with in person. We've had a few, I would say, text messaging and social media contact with one another. I have recognized guest. Our guest today because he has been actively seeking my attention. I would say I'll give a little. I'll give a little bit of background to this, too. I think it was maybe a few months ago I was on a seven figure sales call through Grant Cardone's program. It's the seven figure accelerator program mentoring program. And the mediator at the beginning of the call said, hey, everybody, let's raise your hands and show some enthusiasm because Grant's on the call today. So Grant's not. Not always on these calls, but occasionally he is. And when he is, it's kind of like an event. So I raised my hand, and I had forgotten that I had my hand raised. And then when they were going through the Q and A portion of the call, I heard my name, and they're like, okay, what's your question, Dr. Kramer? And then I'm thinking to myself, oh, I don't have a question. I. I didn't. I forgot my hand was raised. Being on the spot, Grant's like, all right, your hands raised. You might as well ask a question. So I started to give the group, and I would say, this group, normally on these calls, there's anywhere from like 500 to 800 people on these calls, and they're done for their zoom. Calls are done virtually. I said to Grant that I don't have a business. I didn't have a question, but I'm going to start. I am starting a podcast. And Grant goes, a podcast doesn't make any money. And I was like, yeah, I know that. Without getting too much more into the call, I gave him a little bit of a background on my situation. And I said that I inherited some money a little while ago and I had to put that money to work, and I put that money to work in the stock market. And I don't know if Grant and I got into that that much, but this is kind of like a precursor to get to where we are at. Someone of the 806 to 800, someone of the 600 people witnessed this conversation, this interaction that I was having. And then they have been consistently reaching out to me since that call. And at first, because a lot of People reach out to me after these, even when I don't say anything because it's a, it's a networking group. So it's not unnatural for people to reach out to each other. So all of that stuff is normal. But because it happens, because I see so many, I tend not to, I don't always make a chance to make the connection. So one other, one other little tidbit here because I want to bring the audience in with me and my guest who I will announce in a second into, into the conversation that we're about to have. But the seven figure sales call, it educates you on how to approach people and how to kind of take some of the stress that happens when there's a sales process, especially a large scale or higher number sales process, and there's a series of steps that you have to follow and there's things that you have to do. And one of the things that struck me with our guest today, and I promise you I will give you his name and I will get into what the subject matter is, but what struck me with this guest is, and I was thinking about my own experience, he, he commented, I believe, on some of my posts on LinkedIn, he messaged me, he reached out to me in various different ways. And finally this year, because this has been going on for months now, so like finally this year, he reached out to me again and he caught me at the right moment. I think I was present when he reached out, when he commented. So I was able to engage right away. And that led to this meeting of him being on the podcast and another thing that he did right. So if there's a listener out there that wants to really get to me and reach me, what our guest today did, I think was genius in my opinion. He's like, look, I have this presentation. I know you're doing a podcast. I know you said it during the call. And so at the very least, I will be a guest on your podcast. Podcast, if we have this opportunity to talk about what we're talking about. So I'm going to ask a question to the audience. Do you have a strategy, tax free, low risk strategy for investing your money? That's the first, that's the first question, I think if you're of that mindset and you're looking for investments, because that's a lot of what this podcast is about. It's about varying different types of investments. And this one is actually pretty interesting. I've studied it before, I've looked into it before and I have some, some of my own personal opinions and biases on it. But I'm not going to get into that until we I actually get into the conversation with my guest. So he's been patiently waiting through all of my pre ramble here. Now, for seriously, without further ado, I would like to introduce you to Jared Aversano. [00:07:51] Speaker B: Hey, thanks for having me on. All right. You call it a pre ramble. It's a preamble. [00:07:58] Speaker A: All right. [00:07:58] Speaker B: All right, let's do it. I. I love it. I have a lot of respect for what you do and I appreciate you respecting the. It's respecting the sales industry and allowing me the opportunity to present what I got to you. Cool. [00:08:16] Speaker A: So I love it. It's a great start. I didn't even say exactly what the investment was and I left that part out in particular because I think what you do when people know the broad context of it is kind of a boring subject. So I'm going to just say that right away because it's more interesting to think about wealth and making money and how do I grow my wealth than it to think about insurance. So when I was looking at the way that you're positioning yourself on LinkedIn and what struck me right away is it's not like your header says, hey, I sell insurance. Let me tell you why insurance is great. It's just tax free growth, which it could appeal to any investor for any reason. And low risk. You say risk free, but I think everything comes with a certain degree of risk. But I think it's very fair to say low risk relative to other investment types. So I wanted to give a base and give you an opportunity. Like, let's just pretend that you are actually the one calling me now. We've set up the booking. You've gotten to the booking point. You had eight, let's just say you had eight touch points with me. And I know bringing it back to Grant's sales program, he's like, you usually have to reach out to someone, especially a cold call. Like I would be a cold call 8 to 12 times right before you can actually get to a point where you can have communication, where you can actually have a conversation with somebody. So I applaud Jared for, for making that effort. And he reached out to me at least that many times. And now we're here having the conversation and I'm going to pretend like I scheduled on his book because he got me on his book and he and I went back and forth and it's like, you're either on my book or I'm on your book. We don't care. We know. We're just going to have a conversation. And I would like Jared to do his thing from that. From that perspective. So you can just get into it now. And I will. I will play with you. I will play. Play the game. All right. [00:10:28] Speaker B: Okay. So the first thing I start by saying is you said two words, investment and low risk. Now you are right where you say that any investment is going to have risk. Okay. This is not an investment. It's life insurance. If I sold it to you as an investment, I could lose my license. It is not meant to be an investment. [00:10:57] Speaker A: Okay, that's interesting. I didn't know that. [00:11:00] Speaker B: So it was not an investment. [00:11:02] Speaker A: I wouldn't have thought that. Okay. [00:11:03] Speaker B: Okay. So if you're selling universal life policies, a lot of them are sold as investments, but a whole life insurance policy, I'm not allowed to even tell you it's an investment. And because I'm not allowed to tell you it's investment, there is zero risk. It's the only thing that's actually risk free. Okay. Because it's not an investment. So I agree with you where any type of investment is going to have some risk, but this ain't an investment. So this one doesn't have risk. All right. This is a vehicle that you use to purchase investments. [00:11:42] Speaker A: That's interesting to me. Okay, tell me more about that. [00:11:46] Speaker B: Okay, so I usually start by doing five to ten minutes of fact finding. Step one is fact finding. I figure out what the person likes to invest in and how they buy it. [00:11:59] Speaker A: I'm a good person for that. Let's. Let's get into that. [00:12:02] Speaker B: So, Dr. Mark Kramer. [00:12:04] Speaker A: Yes, sir. [00:12:05] Speaker B: What do you like to invest in and how do you usually buy it? [00:12:10] Speaker A: Okay. I like to invest in stocks in the stock market. That's my primary investment vehicle. I have invested in real estate before, but single family. I also play around in the crypto market, but with a very small position sizing. I have a Roth IRA. I have a 401K. Trying to think. So, like, the big thing for me investment wise is the stock market. Let's just go with that. [00:12:38] Speaker B: Okay? Okay. And what do you like best about the stock market? What makes you want to put your money in the stock market? If you had to give me one plain answer. Once again, I am straight from Cardone University. So if you had to give me one answer, why do you put money in the stock market instead of under your mattress? [00:13:00] Speaker A: Say control. Ease of entry and control. Like real estate is a little bit more Complicated and a little bit. It has a higher barrier to entry, and the stock market has a very low barrier of entry. And it's something that I can, for me personally, I can manage. I know the pros and cons versus stocks versus real estate as the two big broad categories. But. But I do. I'm someone that actually likes to actively manage their money. [00:13:31] Speaker B: Okay, so you're like me. You're a control freak. [00:13:34] Speaker A: Yeah, control is the word, for sure. [00:13:36] Speaker B: You're a control freak. [00:13:38] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:13:38] Speaker B: All right. You like control and you like liquidity, is that correct? [00:13:43] Speaker A: 100%. The liquidity, yeah. [00:13:45] Speaker B: Okay, so if I were to sum it up as one thing that you like best about the stock market, is it the liquidity? One word? [00:13:55] Speaker A: Yes. That's fair. That's fair. [00:13:57] Speaker B: Likes liquidity. So then I write down what you like best is liquidity. So I'm getting to know you as an investor. Like this investor likes liquidity. That's important to him. Okay. Now if you could change one thing about the stock market, anything in the world, it could be something crazy. That is not possible. What would it be? [00:14:19] Speaker A: If I could wave a wand and change something about the stock market, what would it be? Is that kind of like the question? I would say there is a balance between the taking the risk aspect. So obviously the stock market can be volatile, especially depending on what assets you like to invest in. So I personally like to invest in technology, large cap growth mostly. So there's a degree of volatility that comes with that. And I don't always love that experience. And if I could, could maintain growth. And here's the other. Here's the other end of that is the dividend stocks, which tend to give you that cash flow aspect that the higher growth stocks don't give you, but you don't get the same level of growth. So if I could find a vehicle that would allow me growth and cash flow, that would be ideal. [00:15:12] Speaker B: Okay, so then the next thing I say is, if I were to show you a vehicle that would have all the liquidity that you like in the stock market, but zero volatility and no risk that actually pays dividends, would that be something that you'd like to take a look at? [00:15:34] Speaker A: It sound like a really good thing? Actually. [00:15:37] Speaker B: It almost sounds made up. Right? [00:15:38] Speaker A: It does sound cool. I appreciate the whole process of it because, like, stepping out of character here first. I mean, I'm being honest, so it's not like I'm stepping out of character, but I'm. I'm coming here with an open Mind to the presentation. And so what I love about what you just did is you did the fact finding really well. The answers I gave you is genuinely what I feel. And when you finally gave me the. Would you call this the proposal? It's not the proposal yet because you haven't really given me an offer yet. But, but it's, but it's testing to see if I can have, if I can present it in such a way that you understand what you're getting for this with what's of value to, to me or for the people who are listening, what is of value to you as an investor? Is this proposal going to meet what your needs are? My needs are liquidity, low volatility and cash flow. Basically, dividends are cash flow. So what you're offering me is a potential opportunity for liquidity, low volatility and cash flow. [00:16:40] Speaker B: Exactly. [00:16:42] Speaker A: Okay, I'm listening. [00:16:43] Speaker B: Okay, cool. So this is just a little drawing that just on the left hand side. On this side, it's what your average human being does. Okay. And then on the right side it's what would the Rockefellers do? [00:17:03] Speaker A: Yes. [00:17:04] Speaker B: Okay. So on the left side we have. Most people take their money. [00:17:09] Speaker A: Can I stop? I'm so sorry to do this because you're getting right into it, but you brought up the Rockefellers and I'm not sure if I'm gonna have that part that we talked about earlier going to be in the final cut. So I just want to give some people a little taste of that. Rockefeller. Where? Why? You said the Rockefellers. There's a book which I'm assuming you read because you seem like you lit up a little bit when I talked about it, which I actually think is a very good book. And if, and if you're interested in anything that Jared and I are talking about, this could be a good resource for you. But it's a book by Eric Gunderson and it's called what Would the Rockefellers Do? Which is an amazing title. And it's basically, I'm assuming people listening know who the Rockefellers sellers are, but if you don't, they were a very wealthy family in the early 1900s. It was a good way to put context to how would life insurance fit into a, a wealth building strategy. All right, so that was the, the Rockefellers analogy. So now please continue. [00:18:09] Speaker B: Cool. [00:18:10] Speaker A: Yes. [00:18:10] Speaker B: And the whole, the whole point to this is that it's not an investment. [00:18:14] Speaker A: Right, Right. [00:18:15] Speaker B: It's a banking system. [00:18:17] Speaker A: Banking system. Okay. And that's how you like become your own bank. [00:18:21] Speaker B: Basically, when you put Money into the bank. Do you ask the bank the rate of return when you're depositing money into the bank? [00:18:28] Speaker A: Yes, of course. [00:18:29] Speaker B: You know, sometimes you get a high yield savings account, but when you put money into a checkings account for liquidity for sure, not with winning, it's not about the returns. [00:18:37] Speaker A: That's right. [00:18:38] Speaker B: Yeah, it's about the liquidity. But a high yield savings account will give you some rate of return, but you got to pay tax on it. Okay, so this is a completely tax free banking system. Most people make money, they put it into the bank, they pay their bills, their living expenses and bs, okay? And maybe they also buy investments. If you're doing what you're, you know, if you want to build wealth, you buy investments right out of your bank account. Okay? What the Rockefellers do, they make money? Okay, this is why the life insurance is not meant to be an investment. You're supposed to have a business, you're supposed to have investments. You're supposed to have a job where you make good money. You got to make the money on your own. I can't make it for you. Life insurance will not get you rich. You have to be willing to work hard completely on your own. Because I didn't show you how to get the money. We started with you having money. So just rather than you depositing it into a bank account and letting it sit there, you still put it into your bank account. But as soon as you put it in your bank account, you put it into your own private banking system. Now, the lady who drew this, her name is Alexis Toledo. I didn't want to give you my chicken scratch. So it's the bank of Toledo. [00:19:55] Speaker A: Okay, Gotcha. [00:19:55] Speaker B: Okay, I can't draw this. [00:19:57] Speaker A: So, so if I wanted, if it was for, if it was personalized, we would call it the bank of Mark. [00:20:03] Speaker B: Yes, Mark's. Well, the bank of Kramer. Because this is going to be future generations as well. [00:20:07] Speaker A: Right? Right, Right, right. [00:20:09] Speaker B: Okay. So you put it into the bank of Kramer. All right? You give, let's say you're making eight grand a month. You take eight grand right out of your bank account, you put it into the bank of Kramer. As soon as you put it into the bank of Kramer, it continues to grow. [00:20:26] Speaker A: I'm going to stop you one second because just for clarification, if I was making 8,000 per month, I wouldn't put the whole 8,000 into the bank of Kramer. Or are you suggesting you put the whole thing in. And there's another thing around that. [00:20:42] Speaker B: Well, so if you're making eight grand a month, you'd rather put eight grand into Chase bank rather than your own private bank? [00:20:50] Speaker A: Now, but I'm genuinely trying to conceptualize this because this, this kind of, in my mind feels like a fresh way to think about it. [00:20:59] Speaker B: I got you. I got. [00:21:00] Speaker A: I know you do. I know you do. [00:21:02] Speaker B: I got you. [00:21:03] Speaker A: I know. So listen. Good client, Mark, listen. So listen. So like, if I had. So let's say right now I just do direct deposit. So I have multiple sources of income, but my primary income is from my, my. And that is directly deposited into a bank. That's directly deposited into. Right now it's directly deposited into Chase Bank. The way I was imagining it with. Because I do have some familiarity with the product that you're presenting, and the way I was imagining it is I would take a percentage of what I'm putting into to the bank and I would maybe direct deposit it or however you transfer funds into the product that you're offering. Now, what you just said made me stop. [00:21:47] Speaker B: Gotta go all in. You go harder, you go home. [00:21:49] Speaker A: Okay? [00:21:50] Speaker B: So seller be sold, you put all your income into the policy. [00:21:54] Speaker A: So this last penny, you're kind of blowing my mind here because that's not what I was imagining at all. [00:22:02] Speaker B: So that's the only way it makes sense. Yeah. [00:22:04] Speaker A: No. Now, so I want to bring everybody on board into what I'm thinking in my own head. And if somebody else listening was thinking the same thing. So let's hear what Jared has to say. [00:22:15] Speaker B: Cool. So you take all your money and you put it into your own private banking system. All right? You have access to 94 of 95% of whatever this grows to. [00:22:29] Speaker A: Okay. [00:22:29] Speaker B: Can't take 100 out. Life insurance companies are super, super healthy. They can't loan you more money than they have. Banks can loan about 900 of what they have. [00:22:40] Speaker A: That's right. [00:22:42] Speaker B: Companies have a one to one reserve ratio. [00:22:44] Speaker A: Okay. [00:22:45] Speaker B: Okay. So they're super healthy. [00:22:47] Speaker A: That, that's a very good point. That's something else that I was not aware of is because when I think of the banking system, I know exactly what you're talking about. It's like reserve to what you can actually loan out is a. Is typically 10, like one. And like it used to be like 10 to 10 to one something, some ratio of that. [00:23:06] Speaker B: Now there's a zero percent reserve ratio as of COVID When Covid was announced, a couple of days after Covid, they changed it to a zero percent reserve ratio. Crazy. Crazy. They're just printing money. The banks are Printing money, loaning it to you. And they make interest on money that they printed. And the American people are paying interest on fake money. It's the rat race. [00:23:35] Speaker A: It's totally the rat race. And when I think about that too, I think about how when you're borrowing money, there's always more because of the interest that you have to pay back. And a system is set up in such a way that it's almost. It's not meant to be. It's. It sounds crazy, but it's not meant to be paid back. You're meant to be indebted. Debt is the reserve currency or the reserve. It's not gold, it's debt. [00:23:58] Speaker B: You ever go to us debtclock.org it grows by a hundred thousand every five seconds. [00:24:05] Speaker A: Okay, yeah, I've done that in a long time ago, but I know exactly. [00:24:09] Speaker B: Westdeck.Org It'll show you just how much debt we're in. [00:24:12] Speaker A: Okay, cool, cool. [00:24:14] Speaker B: So after you put all your money into it, you let it. You give it the opportunity to grow. Okay. Then you borrow money from the life insurance company. Company, opm, Other people's money. Your money's still in there, growing completely tax free. [00:24:33] Speaker A: I'm taking notes. So if the audience is listening to this pause, I mean, it'll be. Some of it will be edited, but I'm pausing because I'm actually taking notes. Opm. From the, from, from. Now, it's interesting because you're putting bank of Kramer. It's, it's amusing to me what's happening here, because let's be honest here, it's like, it's, it's through. It's through the insurance company. It is an insurance company. But I'm conceptualizing it as the bank of Kramer. And if I'm conceptualizing it as the bank of. And listener put in your last name, obviously the bank of you, then. And you're saying other people's money. So I'm borrowing from the bank of you, but you're in sense borrowing from yourself. [00:25:16] Speaker B: You're going to understand this. [00:25:18] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:25:18] Speaker B: The companies that you want to use for the infinite banking concept are mutual participating companies. Therefore, policyholders are shareholders. Shareholders are considered owners of the life insurance company. So you're borrowing it from the life insurance company, but you own the life insurance company. [00:25:38] Speaker A: Interesting. [00:25:39] Speaker B: And that's why you receive dividends. [00:25:41] Speaker A: Okay, okay. So, all right, man, this is really good because I, I was like, I'm very currently at the moment, the most illiquid that I've been. So I'm like, it's gonna be hard to present me anything, but you've definitely got me into an interesting place where I'm like, all right. [00:26:00] Speaker B: To where you're like, why am I putting money in the bank? That's silly. [00:26:03] Speaker A: Yeah, keep talking, Keep talking. [00:26:05] Speaker B: It's not meant. It's not meant to cost you more money. It's meant just to transfer your money from somebody else's bank to your money. All right? Then when you borrow out 94% of 95% or whatever, you got to borrow out. The key is not to borrow everything out. Okay. [00:26:19] Speaker A: Right. [00:26:20] Speaker B: So let's say you build this thing up to $100,000. I stuck a hundred thousand dollars in on day one. You also have that ability. You could do an up an initial cash deposit right away. So let's say you build this thing up to $100,000 and then you got to borrow out five grand a pop, ten grand a pop to pay your expenses. The hundred thousand dollars doesn't go down in value with a non direct recognition company, Another requirement for the infinite banking concept. Mutual participating company and non direct recognition. They don't recognize that you touch the money. [00:26:53] Speaker A: You're gonna have to say that one again because this is where you're actually kind of getting me to be like, wait a minute. Do I understand? [00:26:59] Speaker B: You should have a policy already, Mark, but I'm very happy to be on your show. At the very least, it's great entertainment for your watchers. [00:27:05] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:27:06] Speaker B: But I did get on this with the intentions of selling you a policy eventually. [00:27:09] Speaker A: No, absolutely. And I came on with the intention of not buying one, which is. I think that's how these things work. [00:27:16] Speaker B: 99% of my clients say the same exact thing. But the clients that say that end up being my favorite clients. [00:27:22] Speaker A: Leave it. I hope again, I'm going to step out for just one second. Like, step out of the. What we're doing here. There's two things happening here. One is Jared and I are in a sales mentorship program. So on the one level, we are going through a sales process together. And one of the reasons that I'm doing this personally is because I'm dmed all day long about people that want to sell me stuff. And very few people actually get my attention because it's easy to ignore things when you're flooded all the time. But Jared got my attention because he reached out to me from an event that we were both at. So it was an experience that we both shared, so at least that we had that common ground. And then he was persistent he kept reaching out to me, said, this guy contacted me so many times, and he put himself into places where it's like he didn't just serve himself, but he served me. Anybody that's trying to build a brand on social media, this is stepping out just a little bit. But anybody who's trying to venture out and do something, and you go out there and you put out your content and. And especially in the beginning, nobody likes anything. Nobody's engaging with you. Nobody's doing with you. People are DMing me left and right on LinkedIn, but they never engage with my content. They never comment, they never have a shared experience with me. And that's why they don't get. And that's why Jared and I are having this conversation. Please continue. [00:28:40] Speaker B: Appreciate that. Cool. All right. So you borrow out money. You borrow it at an interest rate of 4.9%. Okay. You got to pay interest. The only way that this makes sense is that they're charging you interest. If they didn't charge you interest, none of this would make sense. You'd be like, what is this guy talking about, free money? No way. So your money continues to grow completely tax free, and they lend you OPM at 4.9%. Not all life insurance companies are created equal. 4.9% is One America Financial. It's the company that I use for my personal policy. I'm a broker. The infinite banking concept requires you to reach out to different companies and use whatever's best for the client. [00:29:21] Speaker A: Okay, that's a good distinction. You're not working for any company. [00:29:25] Speaker B: I don't work for any company. I'm a fiduciary of the client. [00:29:28] Speaker A: Good. And fiduciary, if people don't know what that word means, is someone that has to put your financial interests first. They can't just sell you products because they make a commission off of it. They have to make. People have to make money. You don't sell not to make money, but by calling yourself a fiduciary. And are you like a registered. Is that something you can register for and actually use as your title of fiduciary? [00:29:54] Speaker B: Yeah, I'm a registered life insurance broker. [00:29:56] Speaker A: Right, okay, so registered life insurance broker. But in order to be that broker, you have to be a fiduciary. You have to have a person's financial interest in your best interest. Almost like a doctor taking a hip Hippocratic oath. Like, I promise to not intentionally do harm. So that's. [00:30:14] Speaker B: Yeah, if you go to a. If you go to a Northwestern Mutual, a New York Life, a Primerica. You can only sell their products, you can't sell other products. [00:30:24] Speaker A: Gotcha. [00:30:25] Speaker B: You work for that company, you're a fiduciary for that company. If you're a broker, you could sell any products besides the captive agencies. The captive agencies are the ones where you're stuck there, there and they might pay you a base salary to work there. It might be great benefits. I get nothing, 100% commission. [00:30:44] Speaker A: That's interesting too because I'm thinking, okay. Because it gets just has me thinking about your industry and I'm thinking, okay, so, so, so a broader perspective again, kind of stepping out from the sales process here. If you're looking at this as an industry within the insurance industry, you can be approached by someone that is either working for a specific institution. Like you brought up New York Life. So maybe you' getting presented to by someone from New York Life and their only goal is to give you what New York Life has to offer at whatever rate it is, which is great life insurance. [00:31:18] Speaker B: There's nothing, it's up to you. Absolutely great life insurance. If you die and your family gets millions of dollars, you'd be pretty happy that you have a New York Life policy. [00:31:27] Speaker A: Right. [00:31:28] Speaker B: So there's nothing wrong with it. But when you're using it as a private banking system, that's the infinite banking concept. And if you take the course, there's only five companies, four or five companies that actually support this. There's only a few companies that actually support this. [00:31:42] Speaker A: Okay. [00:31:43] Speaker B: One America Financial, One America Financial Mutual, Emeritas Securities, Mutual of New York. [00:31:49] Speaker A: Okay, so why, so now you got me thinking. Why does New York Life, does New York Life not support this? [00:31:57] Speaker B: Well, because when you borrow from it, it's like 7%. [00:32:01] Speaker A: It's the interest rate is higher. Yeah, it's the interest rate I'm trying to figure out. My question so you understand is, is to find out what's actually the competition here. Because you're competing, you're competing with other brokers, you're competing with other institutions. So what's the competitive sell point? Yeah. [00:32:18] Speaker B: Out of 900,000 life insurance agents, there's only 320 something of us doing it the right way. Okay. [00:32:24] Speaker A: Okay. If you meet with the life insurance agent percentage. [00:32:27] Speaker B: Yeah. If you meet with the life insurance agent and they work for New York Life or Northwestern Mutual and they try to propose this to you, you're going to look at it and say that it doesn't make sense and you're going to think that the whole thing is a sham. And it doesn't make sense because you met with the wrong guy and you looked at the wrong product. That's like a family man walking into the store that's got four kids and somebody's trying to sell him a Ferrari. No, dude, you need a van. [00:32:54] Speaker A: Right, right, right, right, right. So I'm a chiropractor. So industry to industry, there's chiropractors, the last I checked, to about 10% of the population. There's a certain number pool of us, too. I don't know what that number is at this exact moment, but just like an insurance agent might have a reputation associated with their profession, chiropractors also have reputations. And so do medical doctors, and so do all professionals. And so lawyers and nurses, even nurses. And although nurses are a little bit in higher regard because the general populations tend to think that nurses at least care more than the other players. My wife's a nurse. That's the only reason that came up into my mind. So I'm glad you brought up what you just said, because even in my own experience, when I was looking into this, I read Garrett's book, what Would the Rockefellers Do? And I really liked it. And I was very close to doing this, and then they kind of lost me right at the end. And what I started doing was what I think other people should. Honestly, I think you should do and will do is to do your due diligence, which is you're going to go online, you're going to investigate what's the difference between term and life insurance and. And whole life insurance. And then once you do that investigation, you're going to come across a lot of negative. You're going to come across negative press. And so one person top of mind that in terms of name recognition is Ramsey, David Ramsey. He's. He's one of those money guys, right? He hates it. Yeah. He's probably like. If you Google, like whole life insurance, you might find a YouTube clip of him really railing into this. [00:34:31] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:34:32] Speaker A: And going into another thing he hates. [00:34:34] Speaker B: Another thing that he hates. His credit card and debt. Debt. Find me anybody in the world that's a billionaire with a B that doesn't say that you need debt to become a billionaire. [00:34:46] Speaker A: Oh, 100%. And I'm thinking, like, you want to. [00:34:49] Speaker B: Be a hundred grand an air, you could do it without being in debt. If you want to be a hundred grand in there. If you want to make a couple hundred grand a year, be a normal guy, make a good living, that's cool. But if you're shooting for the billionaire, the bee. You need to be in debt. You know how much debt Grant Card. [00:35:05] Speaker A: Own has for sure. I think this is really where I've started to change a lot of my thinking. And again, I keep stepping out because I want people to know, like, I am being presented. You're watching your wisdom real time. It's organic. And I already have my biases coming in. And I think to myself, like, one of the reasons I got into grants program is I was fine. I was happy with my life. I'm still happy with my life. I'm not a younger person that doesn't really know what they're trying to do in life. I'm an established person that has already had some longevity in a career and has already done a lot of the work. So I wasn't seeking a mentor per se. And so somehow, and I actually know how he got me into his funnel. I've shared this story before on other things. I won't get into it, but somehow I got into Grant Cardone's funnel. And one of the things that I am really opening up my mind to because I was turned off by real estate. Estate. It's funny that I'm even looking at the real estate stuff now. But, but and bring. I'm going to bring it into why this has got triggered. Because when I initially said that I like the stock market is because the ease of entry, of getting into the stock market, you don't need a lot of money to do it. It's an easy. It's an easier game to play in terms of price of entry, your ante to play. But when you get into real estate, it's a bigger game, it's a bigger ante. And that's a lot of what keeps people out, including people like me. So what I'm learning through Cardone, and he's not the only one who does this. So if people are listening to this and being like, okay, these are two people that drank the Kool Aid and they're in some kind of other world, everybody's competing. Cardone has competition. I've viewed his competition and I also see that they're kind of presenting the same message. And so whether you're an insurance agent or a chiropractor or a medical doctor, ultimately the message is going to be, if it's correct, the same message. So you can look at a lot of different sources and if you get the message, that's where the opportunity is. So where what Jared is trying to do, which I think is appropriate in this context and the reason I wound up in this funnel, and again, the reason we're having this conversation is because I was content. And Cardone has this expression like be average or be obsessed. Like you're, if you're, if you're not obsessed, going to be average and the average is totally fine. Like you said, there's nothing wrong with that. If you're listening to a, to a podcast called the Money Adjustment, I have to assume that there's something inside of you that wants to adjust something to make more money. So like my own personal journey, my adjustment is like you use the terms going from a thousandaire to millionaire to a billionaire. You have, have higher aspirations, then you're going to look at opportunities like these. And I've seen a lot of people do what you do and kudos to you. None of them got to me. The closest person that ever got to me was Garrett Gunderson and he personally his team, personally his team. I did not talk, he did not call me. We're not friends. Not that I don't like him or we just don't know each other, but he really heavily marketed to the chiropractic community and he got a whole. He broke through to me and I wound up in his funnel. And I say that tongue in cheek, but we all get it. It's 20, 25. You're in funnels. Whether you recognize that or not. You're winding up in somebody's funnel for something. Because we're all trying to educate each other in terms of, hey, do you want to make more money? Like ridiculous amounts of money, Then you're going to have to do things that other people aren't doing. And that's what Jared just illustrated here and that kind of what led into what I was saying. So let's, let's get back to your, what you're doing. [00:38:58] Speaker B: Cool, Cool. So this is a very versatile product. Alright? So you're borrowing money out at 4.9%. The money that you borrow out, it doesn't count as a loan. Okay. Because you own part of the life insurance company, it's a mutual participating company. So you're technically loaning money to yourself, pledging your money as collateral. They don't need your credit, they got your money as collateral. Collateral. Why would they need your credit? You pledged your money. So it doesn't pop up on a credit report, it doesn't pop up on a debt to income ratio. So if you go to buy another property, like a real estate investment, you can use this money to get another Loan. You could use a loan from the life insurance company to get a loan from a bank, buy a real estate investment, then use the real estate investment to funnel back into the life insurance company. Now if you didn't want to do that and you just wanted to use it to pay your expenses, you borrow this money out, you go get a 0% interest rate credit card, you open up an LLC. As soon as you open up an LLC, you're going to get offers for 15 months, 0% interest rate. My favorite one is the Chase Inc. Chase Business Inc. 0% for 15 months. You rack it up. Not rack it up like irresponsibly, but anything that you would usually pay cash for or put on a credit card and then pay off off. You put it on a 0% interest rate credit card. You wait until the 15th month right before they start charging you interest, okay? Then you take a loan from your life insurance policy and you pay it off. And the entire time, rather than paying your bills with your money, you're compounding your money and paying your bills after. You're paying yourself first and then your credit card bills last. Most people pay their bills first and then they save money at the end. In this scenario, you're paying yourself first and you're paying the credit cards at the very end or your bills at the very end, your investments, your properties, anything, your expenses. And then as soon as you pay off this credit card, it's actually good for your credit, your credit usage is gonna, your credit usage is gonna go down and you're gonna go get more credit cards because you're gonna have more offers and you're gonna have the best credit score. Score. It's going to keep going up from doing this. You're going to have practically no debt on your credit. Whatever you have on the credit card counts, obviously, but you're using the life insurance company's money to clear off the credit card. Get yourself back down to like below a 10 or a 15 credit usage. Then you go get more credit cards and you just live your life off of other people's money instead of your own. And your money stays put in your private banking system, continuing to compound until the day you die. [00:41:39] Speaker A: Guy. Yeah, I, I love how you're doing this with a smile too, because I, I have to, I, I have a lot of respect for you because I'm really impressed with how far you've gotten and how deep in my head you are right now. And if you're a listener listening, I wonder if what kind of impressions that our Friend Jared here is having on you now. Now, here's the part. [00:42:02] Speaker B: This is my website, if anybody is interested. I don't know if it's backwards, but It's Jared from li.com. i'm from Long Island, New York. Li. [00:42:10] Speaker A: Li. Long Island. I was wondering about that myself. I'm like, from Li. Okay, Long Island Jared from Lilongisland.com. so not long island, just Jared. R, E, D, F, O, R. I mean, sorry, F-R-O-M-L-I.com. okay. [00:42:27] Speaker B: Instagram's Jared from LI. Everything's Jared from LI. [00:42:31] Speaker A: Are you on an X? [00:42:32] Speaker B: Jared from LR next on X. It might actually be Jared Aversanto on X. I'll send you the link. [00:42:39] Speaker A: I'll send me your X link because I'm building my. I'm building on X. [00:42:42] Speaker B: Okay, I want you to. I want you to send me your phone number. I never got your phone number. We did it all. [00:42:48] Speaker A: I'm going to send you my phone number. I'm going to send you my phone. [00:42:50] Speaker B: And that's another thing about sales in 2024. Stop taking it so serious. If you're messaging somebody and they're messaging you back, be cool with getting it over message. That person is comfortable on the messaging platform. They don't want you to call them. They would have given you their cell. If he's willing to book an appointment with you, do it over message. [00:43:11] Speaker A: Right? Yeah. And I agree with that. So right now I said, you're kind of deep in my head right now because now I'm like genuinely really processing what you're saying. And for the listeners, for a long time, I've been thinking to myself, and I've heard it so many times, and I didn't really. And I still can't say that I get this 100%. Wealthy people, people borrow money and they live off of borrowed money. And when people hear that, it's for the regular person to hear that, for me to hear that. My background, like my mom, I grew up, and maybe someone listening has a similar situation to me. When I grew up, my mom said, do not get into any debt. Debt is bad for you. So. And I'm not making the judgment. Let's just keep the story where it's at. This is me keeping myself on track here. [00:44:00] Speaker B: Dave Ramsey. [00:44:01] Speaker A: Yeah, Dave Ramsey. Okay. Yeah. Public figure. Exactly. Dave Ramsey and my mom would have gotten along great because they both agree in this particular area that you don't take on debts. Right now, my largest debt is my student loan debt. I hate it. I'm still paying it off. It's just part, part and parcel. I'm at like 1% on my student loan debt. So, like, this is an aside. I'm like 1 point something percent. So part of the reason I'm not paying it off is because when am I ever going to get a large sum of money at such a low interest rate? So that's the reason that that's continuing on. But outside of that, I've tried to keep my consumer debt very low. I pay my bills off every month. I rarely use credit cards. And part of the reason that I rarely use credit cards is because I don't want debt, I don't want interest, I don't want to owe anybody anything. It kind of goes back to control. I just don't want to owe anybody anything, which is not entirely possible because even if you own your home, you still have to pay tax. Taxes. So you're still, you're not getting. If you're existing in this world, you do not live on an island and everybody owes somebody something for something. So outside of that, it's sticking to the credit card world. I. My mentality. And it still is. I don't know if you've cracked this shell yet. You've, you've definitely like poked a little hole in there. I'm thinking, all right, so what I'm seeing this, my head is saying like, oh my God, I'm just borrowing, borrowing, borrowing. I'm going to have all this increased debt they're taking now that you told me. I'm throwing my whole paycheck in there. I'm like, they're taking all my earned income. I'm getting deeper and deeper into debt. And now when my legacy, when I pass away, I'm going to say something here. It's a little premature for this part, but this was one of my concerns. And I think one of the reasons that I balked the first time I got this presentation, let's say it was like five years ago ago, is that, that I had heard the horror stories. And you might find this on people, listeners might find this online too, where there is no payout at the end, which is. Would be the most devastating thing. And I think Ramsey hammers this point. That would be. And it's hard to know because if you die, because this is all. You're not seeing this money that's going in and if you're a partner and owner and all that kind of stuff, there's I, it's not. That part's Interesting. I really feel like it can get into that with you a little bit more because I'm like, am I an owner guy that you're working with? [00:46:28] Speaker B: Yeah, that's trust in the guy that you're working with. I was in the military. I pride myself on being a very trustworthy guy. [00:46:35] Speaker A: Thank you for your service. Thank you. [00:46:39] Speaker B: I tell people that on the day you die, God forbid, I will be coming to your wife and giving her the millions of dollars. [00:46:46] Speaker A: Yeah. So here. [00:46:47] Speaker B: It's not a big company. [00:46:48] Speaker A: It's a small bit around longer than you. And I know people listening to are going to maybe appreciate what I'm saying here. I love salespeople. I really do. I'll tell you why I love salespeople. They love you. If you're a prospect and they're. They're doing their job, they make you feel like the most important person in the world. Because in that brief moment that you're with them, having these kind of conversations, you are to them, you are relative to. To their income and their living. But what happens in most situations, and this is my personal experience, is that I fall in love with the salesperson. Then the salesperson disappears. I get an account representative. The account representative doesn't care about me, and I'm just another number on a book. And I never have that same feeling of love again. So now Jared's telling me, like, 10, 20, 30, 50 years from now, I'm going to come to your wife and give her your. Your life insurance check or your heirs, if however that plays out. And there's everything in my being in the. In the recesses of my mind is saying BS just to be fair with you. I'm with you. [00:47:58] Speaker B: And let me tell you the honest answer. There's two reasons. There's two reasons why I'm going to come to your wife and give her the money. Reason number one is because I'm a real nice guy. Reason number two, I'm going to ask her for more referrals. [00:48:09] Speaker A: Okay. [00:48:10] Speaker B: I'm a real sales guy and a real sales guy guy. You give exceptional service and your clients give you referrals like crazy. So if I disappear on you, I'm just telling you the honest truth. [00:48:25] Speaker A: That's an honest answer. Because a rational person, because we're all more the same than we are different. We think we're all different and we chose the right profession and everything. Everybody else is doing something off. But in the end, when someone says, the reason I'm going to do this is honestly, I. I don't believe people unless the reason they give me is a selfish reason. Reason. Because ultimately we have to have our own self interest. And if there's not a self interest component. This guy doesn't know me. He just met me. We're just having this first time we're talking. I have three children. I have three children. [00:48:57] Speaker B: The way I see it is we get you a policy, we get your wife a policy. I'm getting all three of your children. If I disappear on you, that'll never happen. Yeah, that's life insurance. [00:49:12] Speaker A: Just kind of did that. I was like, this is getting. Maybe I don't want to get too much into it because I. I appreciate what you're saying, and I think you're saying the right things, but I. Again, I'm balking. And the reason I'm balking is because it's a personal experience. I had a very good conversation with someone that I know personally. He. He's a founder of a business. He got me. I don't want to give too much away, because if I give too much away, I'm going to call the person out. And we're still friends, so I don't want to do that. But he gave me an investment thing, and I trusted him wholehearte. And now I have more headaches. Headaches than I would like. It's one of the most annoying things that I have going on right now. And if my friend's listening, it's still bugging me. And I love you, but we need to work this out. But that's a. That's a. That's a big digression. So you're saying you want to get everybody. You're basically asking for all my money. So I'm going to give you all my money, all my paychecks that are coming in. I still have to earn it. You're. I'm not getting free money from you. I'm giving you all my money, and I'm giving you my wife's money and my kids money. And I'm really putting a lot of faith in you. You and. You and I have just met. [00:50:17] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. 100%. 100%. [00:50:20] Speaker A: Okay. Okay. I just want to make sure everybody's on the same page. [00:50:24] Speaker B: And the key to this entire thing is that it's not an investment. [00:50:28] Speaker A: Okay. [00:50:29] Speaker B: It's not an investment. It's not. [00:50:31] Speaker A: I'm going to tell you this. I'm going to tell you this right now, and I hope people do this, too. Honestly, if you're a listener, is that when you say this Isn't an investment. That was a, that was a paradigm shift for me because I, this show for me is about investing in trading. And I was thinking about this in, in an investment way. And obviously you understand that people listening to you are going to think that, which is why you, you have repeated and are and are appropriate to do so to clarify for people, this is not an investment. This is not an investment. I'm saying that out loud as much for myself as for anybody else, because I have to shift my own thinking because I'm looking at this as, oh, this is a different type of investment. [00:51:12] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:51:12] Speaker A: And if you're not, if you're an. [00:51:15] Speaker B: Investment, the government, the government wants their share. When you make an investment, they want taxes. And then you got to take all the risk. So the government doesn't take any risk with you. They only share in the reward with you. A K, a taxes, but you get to take all the risk. That's an investment. [00:51:31] Speaker A: Okay, Right, right, right. If I take all the risk. And honestly, I always feel like I'm taking all the risk on everything that I do. And again, it's personal. I'm not saying like you have to risk risk to make money. So. And especially if you're in the stock market, it's risk rewards. So you're always balancing what you're risking versus what the potential reward is. So I'm going to ask you a couple things before we go any further because as you've promised a lot, you've made things sound really exciting. I'm even kind of thinking about this in my own mind and maybe some listeners are too. So. So how long have you been doing this? [00:52:03] Speaker B: For about a year now. [00:52:05] Speaker A: Okay, so here's like another thing. And I'm telling you, man, my entrepreneur friend, friend, four years owned this company, was a founder, gave me this great presentation. And then things happen. Entrepreneurs, businesses, things happen. Someone young is promising you to be there 50 years from now. I'm still gonna, I'm just gonna be honest with you, Jared. There's nothing in my mind, in my life experience that believes that to be true. Not that you don't believe it to be true or it's not your true intention. So I want to put aside and. [00:52:37] Speaker B: Get hit by a, by a bus. What if I step outside and get hit by a bus? Literally? Yeah. And if that were to happen, you're with One America Financial, you're with the insurance company. Okay. If that were to happen, One America Financial has been around for 200 plus years. So that, that is what would happen. [00:52:57] Speaker A: So you're. You're not. And this is, I think, a good distinction. I'm helping you out because I'm giving part of it, but it's me thinking through it as well, and anybody should think about it. No, it's good. I love it. I love it. I wouldn't even. Let's go. I know. I wouldn't even challenge you if I didn't think you could handle it. So I think people should take comfort. I would take more comfort in what Jared just said, in knowing that, okay, Jared's a great guy. He's promising a lot of great things. I like Jared. I would love it if he was actually the guy giving the check to my wife at the end of all of this, assuming that that's the way things proceed. But the reality is, through my life experience, anybody who's over probably 25, older is going to be thinking like. Or. Or in some way knowing, like, I have a feeling Jared and I will, like, be friends after this regardless. So maybe, like, even smiling. And I feel that, too. We'll be friends after this. So it won't even just be that he's the sales guy and he sold me something. But it's like, it's not about Jared. Jared, Jared, or any salesperson, a chiropractor, pitching you on the subluxation of the spine and why your back pain is related to the subluxation or all your health problems are related to subluxation. It's not that person pitching you. It's the ability of the salesperson to communicate what they're actually offering to you and allow you, the consumer, to make an educated decision. So Jared said early on, if there's 9,000 people that. That do this and only about three, 300 of them can do it properly, when properly is educating you so that you actually understand what you're committing yourself to and then making an educated decision. So Jared's drawn some stuff. I'm going to let him go into what he's drawing here. [00:54:50] Speaker B: Okay. So is this all backwards or is this. [00:54:54] Speaker A: Yes, it's all backwards words. [00:54:56] Speaker B: Okay, so I'm gonna. I'm gonna read it while I go through it. [00:55:00] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:55:01] Speaker B: Okay. [00:55:02] Speaker A: You can still make it out, but it's interesting that it's backwards. Yeah, I mean, it's fine. Where's like, a mirror? It's just a mirror image. You gotta, like, flip it, right? Flip the screen or something. I wouldn't know how to do it. You did better. How'd you do that? Magic. [00:55:17] Speaker B: I can do anything, Mark. [00:55:19] Speaker A: No. [00:55:19] Speaker B: Okay. Put your faith in me. [00:55:21] Speaker A: Wait a minute. [00:55:22] Speaker B: It was either insurance or comedy. I chose insurance. [00:55:26] Speaker A: I love it, man. And I. You have a great personality. I, I wish you, whatever happens after this, I want nothing but success for you because you're the kind of person that deserves it. Yeah. [00:55:35] Speaker B: Thank you. I appreciate that. [00:55:36] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:55:37] Speaker B: All right. So in an insurance policy you have a base premium. Okay. The base premium goes towards cash and cost of insurance. I'm going to be completely honest. Most of it's going towards cost of insurance. Especially in the earlier years. All right, right. In the later years it starts to flip flop. But in the earlier years, this is the whole catch. In the earlier years, you got to pay for life insurance. [00:56:03] Speaker A: So what comes to mind, and it might come to mind for a lot of people that are somewhat financially savvy. And even if you own a home, you have to understand this. It's like a mortgage. If you borrow for a mortgage, you are going to pay more of the interest up front because the person who lends you the money, the opm, wants to make sure to protect their end of it that they're getting paid and over. You're going to be paying less to them and you're going to actually be paying off more of the principal. [00:56:33] Speaker B: Exactly. [00:56:34] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:56:36] Speaker B: So if, if it wasn't securities Mutual New York, I just got an Instagram DM from another life insurance agent asking me, what company do you recommend for the infinite banking concept? Somebody in New York, securities Mutual of New York or Emeritus? Those the two One America Financial writes every state besides New York. I'm from New York. Imagine how hard that is for me. [00:56:58] Speaker A: Oh, man. Yeah. [00:57:00] Speaker B: How many? [00:57:00] Speaker A: How many? You said this earlier. I just want to make sure I'm remembering it correctly. There's only about five institutions that do this or more. [00:57:07] Speaker B: There's. So when you go to the infinite banking course, it's in Alabama, the Nelson Nash Institute, they teach you you should either use One America Financial Mass Mutual Emeritas or securities Mutual of New York. That's what they teach you. [00:57:25] Speaker A: And they teach you that. [00:57:26] Speaker B: Or guardians. Or guardian. [00:57:27] Speaker A: Or guardians. You're like, I know he's got something on that. [00:57:30] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. So I don't use guardian. I don't use guardian because One America Financial is. It grows the fastest. Okay. [00:57:37] Speaker A: Okay. You seem like you, you're favoring that one by. [00:57:41] Speaker B: When I hear you. That's the one I have for my personal. [00:57:43] Speaker A: Okay, so it makes sense. [00:57:44] Speaker B: They have the lowest interest rate rate, the rate of borrowing Ameritas is 5.11. America Financial is 4.9. [00:57:52] Speaker A: Okay, fair. [00:57:53] Speaker B: That's. [00:57:54] Speaker A: That makes a lot of sense. That's where the comp. Everything's a competition. So it's like, okay, why do you choose one over the other? This aspect of it makes sense. [00:58:01] Speaker B: And like nationwide, I'm on your side, so I get you the best one. All right? So in any insurance policy, you have a base premium in the earlier years, you're paying for cost of insurance. This is what it makes. This is what makes it make sense. A lot of people talk about this as an investment where have to pay the cost of insurance and it's building cash for you like crazy. That's the, the bad that's going around about the insurance industry. That's the bad taste in your mouth about insurance, okay? Because there's no way of getting around paying for your life insurance. You have to pay for your life insurance. [00:58:33] Speaker A: Right? [00:58:33] Speaker B: There's a cost, right? [00:58:35] Speaker A: So you have to pay your life millions of dollars. Exactly. You have to pay for your. That money for your insurance is. Has to serve its purpose. And if you die and you're getting promised a certain amount, like your premium is going into whatever amount that's upon that money has to come from somewhere. [00:58:52] Speaker B: And that money, Dave Ramsey Ramsey would say that that's a waste of money. And it's like, okay, if you don't see value of leaving your family $15 million, if you die at the age of 95, then you don't see value in it. Cool, whatever. You don't see value and leaving behind 15 mil, that's cool. And then you could be like, a Dave Ramsey guy would be like, but you could do that with stocks. Do both. Why wouldn't you do both? Both? If you don't have enough money, then, okay, I get it, I get it. If you don't have enough money and you can't afford to do it, that makes sense. Okay? [00:59:27] Speaker A: It's, you know, the money. The money is always the rub. Because even I just had this conversation with someone from the real estate mentorship program, and he's also a guest on the podcast. So if you're anybody listening, if you're interested in these kinds of things, I did an earlier episode with him on investing in multifamily real estate estate. And I told them, okay, let's say this person has a hundred thousand dollars to invest. And how should they invest that? A hundred thousand dollars? It's like, that part is fine, but the idea is like, once that hundred thousand dollars is gone, it's gone. So if you're going to perpetuate this process, you just have to keep making money. There's no way around the aspect of you just have to make money and you have to pay for things and things have to get paid for. So that's a kind context, text and context and a little bit of the rub. Because people are like, I just want everything for. I just want you to tell me all the good stuff. Don't tell me that I'm paying for anything. And if I'm paying for something, which is where you're getting at, I'm paying for something right now. [01:00:28] Speaker B: Yeah, but you receive something of value in return. The death benefit. [01:00:32] Speaker A: The death benefit, right. [01:00:34] Speaker B: And that's where Dave Ramsey is like, it's a scam. It's not true. You don't really make money. But it's like, yeah, dude, you're getting life insurance, bro. You're buying a life insurance policy. Chill out. [01:00:45] Speaker A: Okay, Right. [01:00:46] Speaker B: All right. So your base premium is going towards cost of insurance during the first earlier years. All right. Any additions you do go straight towards your cash value. [01:00:57] Speaker A: Okay. [01:00:58] Speaker B: When you make an additional payment towards a house mortgage, you can allocate it to go straight towards principal and you could start building equity faster in your, your home. Same thing as a life insurance policy. When you make an additional payment towards a life insurance policy, you can allocate it to go straight towards cash value. So that's what you do if you want to see returns on this. You set your base premium to a number, your disposable income, the money that you don't care about. At the end of each month, you set your base premium to your disposable income. And then you over fund and put additions in there to build your private banking system. System. Okay. Now why I like One America Financial is because One America Financial allows you to do a multiplier of 10 in the first year. So your base premium, you take it, you multiply it by 10, and that's the most amount of money that you could put in in year one. [01:01:50] Speaker A: Okay, what is just for comparison, what do some of the other institutions offer that do this? No, I. If. Yeah, but. Oh. [01:01:58] Speaker B: 4X x 1America Financials 10x everybody else is 4x general. [01:02:04] Speaker A: How can they afford to do that versus their competitors? [01:02:08] Speaker B: They make less money. [01:02:10] Speaker A: They make less money up from. [01:02:13] Speaker B: They're a smaller insurance firm, they're making less money than Northwestern Mutual New York Life. It's not, is it in terms of. [01:02:19] Speaker A: Like acquisition, maybe like in the beginning, if you're getting. Are they, they're smaller firm, Are they a newer firm? [01:02:27] Speaker B: They've been around for 200 years. [01:02:29] Speaker A: 200 years. [01:02:30] Speaker B: But they are, they are, they are a newer firm, but they've been around for 200 years. [01:02:34] Speaker A: What are the other ones? Like 300? Like how long is this? Yeah. What is how long? [01:02:38] Speaker B: Life insurance. Life insurance has been around since before the Great Depression. [01:02:43] Speaker A: Okay. [01:02:44] Speaker B: Life insurance predates the United States income tax code. That's why it grows tax free. It's been around for a long time. [01:02:51] Speaker A: That's very interesting to me. Say that again because I think people need historical context for what happening dates. [01:03:00] Speaker B: It predates income tax. It predates income tax. [01:03:04] Speaker A: Wow, that's interesting. [01:03:05] Speaker B: That's how old these companies are. Okay, okay. So One America Financial allows you to put in a 10 times multiplier in year one. So if your base premium is 30 grand, you could stuff 300 grand in, in the first year. Okay, okay. In year two and every year after that you could do a four times multiple multiplier. [01:03:28] Speaker A: It's just for the first year. So now I'm kind of getting this a little bit better. So it's like if you wanted to get on a phone plan and Verizon offers you a free phone or something like that, they might say your first year you don't pay anything. But then after the first year, then it goes to our regular rate. So that's what this is. Basically. It's a, it's an acquisition cost. It's almost like a loss leader. It's like, okay, we'll eat it for the first year, but after that we know we're going to get that four. [01:03:53] Speaker B: Yeah, literally that makes sense. Stuff you could stuff money in and basically fast forward like three years. [01:04:01] Speaker A: So you want to front load it. You're front by getting into the additions. I'm going to, because, because we didn't discuss this and I think I brought these terms up earlier and, and if they make it through the edit and I think they will. But, but, but just so for people who are listening, when you're think, think about life insurance. When you start to invest in life insurance and think about whether or not you need it and most people, honestly, they need it. Most people you like, you have to have life insurance. There's all, there's no way around that aspect of it. If your intention is to preserve your wealth or protect your family or making sure bad things don't happen, like you can't pay your, like if you die, your wife can't pay Your mortgage and things of that nature. So you, you're. It's a, it's a protective mechanism. So the two broad categories are term and life or whole life. And so with term, term insurance, the way I understand it, and this was an analogy that was given to me that I thought was a great analogy, term insurance, you're renting, it may cost you less money, you don't pay as much. But once the. It's term because it's finite, meaning you either get it for a certain number of years, 10 years, 20 years, 30 years, and then if you outlive the 30 years, you get nothing. So whatever little amount you paid in during those 30 years, let' at the end of those 30 years, you don't get anything. The people that would say still get term. Like let's, let's take Dave Ramsey's perspective, get term, pay less money and take all the money you're not paying for whole and then go invest it in something. [01:05:29] Speaker B: See, it's so strange because. [01:05:32] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, I just want to juxtaposition. I don't want to cut you off, but I just want to make sure because that was term and this is whole. The way I understand it, whole is you're buying the house, you're not renting, wanting it. And at the it, there's no whole means, there's no end date to it. So when you die, you get the money, period. So you're supposed to. And again, that goes into where it's like, I don't know. And this is, this is one question I legitimately have for you in terms of like making me feel more comfortable is like, I don't want to live my life for 30 years. 30 or 40 or, you know, however many more years I have ahead of me, God willing, I don't want to think about at the end of all of those decades of taking on a certain vehicle strategy that in the end that there's going to be something in the clause that said, well, you don't get your life insurance because you had. Let's just use a common example. I don't have this, but a lot of people have. This is smoking. Let's say you're a smoker. And so your life expectancy for smokers, there's got to be variables like that any insurance is like that health insurance. If you put down your smoke smoker, it changes. You're gonna start coughing on me. [01:06:42] Speaker B: When I talk about smoking, maybe it was psychological. [01:06:46] Speaker A: I know I almost felt like I held something back. So. But you get where I'm going with this where it's like, I worry that at the end that something's gonna happen and they're gonna find a way. What is that thing that recent? The UnitedHealthcare CEO. There was like a mass conscious awareness because of the tragedy that happened. And it was something like, did not. I, I don't remember what the three things are. You know what I'm talking about? It was like, like defer, deny, whatever. And so it's basically how insurance companies are set up in such a way that they don't want to pay you. So I, I think there's a little bit of that in the psyche and I, I would. How do you address that? [01:07:25] Speaker B: When you submit an application, you get approval. If you're a smoker at the time of your application, you go in as a smoke, a smoker. If you become a smoker later in life, you're already locked in Whole life insurance. You are guaranteed the death benefit. All right, There are things like term life, like universal life insurance, where. Universal life insurance, they could change it up on you. I don't want to get too far into that because I don't sell universal. But universal is the bad taste in the mouth where people were getting denied death claims. Transamerica lawsuits, World Financial Group. Universal. [01:08:02] Speaker A: A whole nother tier. Like when I put term and life is universal, like a whole nother thing. Is it like a third? [01:08:09] Speaker B: Now, see, the tiers are term and perm. Perm means permanent, temporary term and permanent. Underneath term, you have regular term and you have premier term. Premier term can be converted. So permanent life insurance. So if you're 30 years old and you get premier term, and it's for 20 years, on the 18th year you can convert it to whole life. [01:08:36] Speaker A: That's interesting. [01:08:36] Speaker B: Premier term. So there's like subcategories. [01:08:39] Speaker A: Okay, Yeah, I appreciate that. [01:08:40] Speaker B: And now perm, perm, permanent. There's final expense, which just covers the cost of your funeral. Doesn't, doesn't build you much cash value, doesn't have the benefits like that. It just covers the cost of your funeral. But it's permanent. Okay. Just meant to cover the cost of your funeral. That's where you see like $50,000 death benefits, $100,000 death benefits, stuff like that. Okay, that's final expense. Then you have whole life, which is the oldest type of life insurance, which is what we do. It's the most conservative, the slowest growing type. It grows the slowest. [01:09:14] Speaker A: Right. [01:09:15] Speaker B: Tax free. [01:09:16] Speaker A: Right. [01:09:16] Speaker B: Okay. Then you have universal. Universal is relatively new and in the book becoming your own banker, it's referred to as a monstrosity. So what universal life insurance is, it's the life insurance industry's attempt at unbundling the cash value from the death benefit. So you basically have a term policy that renews on you every year. So as you get older, it renews on you and you get a new price, a new cost of insurance every, every year. So your base premium can actually go up. Okay. But you still have the cash value attached to it. A lot of people that buy this, they buy it because when you're 20 something years old, the cost of insurance, super, super cheap. So they get sold the universal policy in their 20s and then when they turn 40, the base goes up, the cost of insurance goes up, and it starts eating their cash value. Value. But it's not explained correctly. [01:10:19] Speaker A: Interesting. Like, even I'm. I was pretty much following you through all of this, and then when we threw that universal. I know, I'm just saying this, I'm being honest because I think people listening too, because some people might even start to get confused at this point. And if you start to get confused about something, then you start to drift off and you're not paying attention anymore. So not to get bogged down with the universal aspect of it because. Because it already sounds like you. You're not. This is not what you're presenting. [01:10:42] Speaker B: That's not what I do. Encouraging. [01:10:44] Speaker A: Yes. Yeah. So I. So I might, if you're a curious person, then maybe look into that on your own and see why. Why he wouldn't want to. Why Jared wouldn't want to recommend this. But let's just stick with this whole. Yeah, exactly. [01:10:56] Speaker B: Cool. So the whole life is guaranteed. It's the most expensive type of life insurance. It's the most conservative. But the death benefit is guaranteed. I mean, other than that. Do you have any more questions? I mean, have you seen enough to make a decision? [01:11:10] Speaker A: That's good. Perfect. Closing it out in Grant Cardone fashion, I'm going to tell you my honest answer. And I. And I love you. Like I said, at the end of this, you and I are going to be friends. So this, that's not an issue. [01:11:24] Speaker B: I just had to ask. [01:11:25] Speaker A: They know you have to ask my uncle. I told you this privately. My uncle has whole life insurance. He retired I don't know how many years ago now. He was a success, successful ophthalmologist in Syracuse. He's. He was a New Yorker, another New Yorker. And he still has his pop policy. He's getting older I'm not wishing him ill will at all. I hope he continues to outlive everybody. But he has a policy that's a whole life. He's happy with it. He hasn't had a problem with any of, like, he's been just doing what you're saying for and, and allowed it to build up for like 10, 20, 30, 40 years. And now this sounds morbid, but I'm like, I'm waiting to see. And I, I'm not saying I'm waiting because I understand too, there's an opportunity costs if my uncle dies 10 years from now, and then I get to see, oh, was this life insurance thing real? That's 10 years that I could have been investing it. Not investing. That's 10 years I could have been using this vehicle that I'm not using it. And that's, that's an opportunity cost. So I'm giving context for that because honestly, I have not seen enough yet, because I need to. And so let's just play this, this out. I, I'm going to say no, because I haven't seen enough yet. And what would your, what is your reply to that? [01:12:46] Speaker B: Beautiful. So I'm going to share my screen with you. [01:12:50] Speaker A: Okay. [01:12:50] Speaker B: Because honestly, if you're like, oh, man. [01:12:52] Speaker A: We'Re here an hour and a half. Yeah. [01:12:54] Speaker B: Yeah. Because honestly, if you told me yes, I would think you're a madman because I didn't even give you the presentation. [01:13:00] Speaker A: Right. Fair enough. Because I'm like, I don't know. I don't know how much I'm dishing out and I don't know how much I'm paying for each of these, these things. Jared's browser needs screen permission. Sure thing. Let's do it. [01:13:09] Speaker B: So you can see my screen. [01:13:11] Speaker A: Can see your screen. [01:13:13] Speaker B: All right, beautiful. So the first feature I want to point out for a whole life insurance policy is that premiums cannot increase for your whole life because of inflation. The cash value, the value of a dollar, continues to decline over time. So what I'm showing you is eleven hundred dollars a month. Now, $1,100 might sound like a lot right now. Now. But 30 years from now, it's going to be the. A trip to the grocery store for a family of three. [01:13:38] Speaker A: Okay, that's. It's getting close to that. It's going to happen faster than we think. [01:13:43] Speaker B: Yeah. Okay. So due to inflation, you're locked in at an affordable rate for the rest of your life. All right. The next thing I'll point out is that the companies that we use for the infinite banking concept are called mutual participating companies. Companies. In these companies, the policyholders are considered shareholders of the company. Therefore you literally receive profit share from the performance of the life insurance company in the form of dividends. Okay, so you're getting dividends. [01:14:13] Speaker A: Very interesting. So I'm paying out the monthly premium,100. I don't have any cash value from that because the cash value is the additions that I add on top of the actual insurance insurance. But let's say I don't do the additions. Do I still get a dividend? [01:14:32] Speaker B: You're still going to get dividends as long as the company pays dividends that year. [01:14:36] Speaker A: Okay. Okay. The dividend is going to vary because it's profit sharing. In a sense, yes. It's a different type of profit sharing. [01:14:44] Speaker B: Exactly. Cool. All right. Now the next thing I'll point out is that the death benefit is completely tax free. Okay. Okay. Your family is guaranteed the death benefit completely tax free. It's for estate planning. You, you already have life insurance, so I know that you already see value in that. Now if you check this out, it goes from 9.8 million to 2.1 million. That's because this whole life policy has a term insurance rider attached to it. A 15 year insurance rider. Rider attached to the whole life. You following me? [01:15:22] Speaker A: I'm trying. I kind of like drifted a little bit because I was like, wow. As I get older, it's. This is how I perceived it, and I might have been perceiving it incorrectly is like the death benefit is better if I pass away younger. [01:15:35] Speaker B: Hold on. The reason why. [01:15:37] Speaker A: Yes. [01:15:38] Speaker B: The reason why is because there's a term insurance policy attached to it. [01:15:42] Speaker A: Isn't that the universal where there's like a term and the combination. Nathan. [01:15:46] Speaker B: No. [01:15:47] Speaker A: Okay. [01:15:48] Speaker B: No. This is whole life with a term rider attached. [01:15:53] Speaker A: Okay. How does that difference between whole life and term together? [01:15:59] Speaker B: Well, whole life by itself is the most expensive form of life insurance. Term is the cheapest. So. So we give you a little bit of the most expensive type so that you could build cash value. And then if you want a higher death benefit for your family. Family. We supplement it with term. [01:16:17] Speaker A: I see, I see. So the term is why it goes down from 9 million to like 2 million is because the term. It's so funny, it's so weird talking about anything that has to do with death because you have to come face to face with your own mortality. And I'm looking at this and it's like, wow, if I die younger, my family will get more money. [01:16:40] Speaker B: Well, that's because the term, right now I get it. Any and most of the term insurance that I sell because I love whole life so much is convertible to whole life. If we're attaching, if we're attaching a term rider to the whole life policy, you're going to have the ability to convert the term to more whole life as you make more money. So when your uncle passes away, like you said, and you get that insurance money, you're going to want to convert. [01:17:09] Speaker A: Getting that insurance money. But his, his kids are like, I want to be clear on that. I'm not getting any of my uncle's money. He's just someone that I know and have conversations with that he's doing this. All right, okay. [01:17:21] Speaker B: But as time goes by, let's say, let's say I meet with a 25 year old or a 26 year old where they could do a $200 policy right now, but they want the ability to do more in the future without having to take another physical. This is what we do for them. We write them a small policy with term attached so that they could convert the term at a later date and get more whole life. [01:17:44] Speaker A: Okay? [01:17:45] Speaker B: Okay. And there's also another reason to attach a term rider. So reason number one is to lock you in at an affordable rate for the future so you can convert it at a later term. And reason number two is because if you're trying to stick in $100,000, okay, the government is not going to let you stick in $100,000 unless if you have a high enough death benefit. It's called a modified endowment contract. Life insurance is non taxable. It has to be life insurance. It's not an investment. So if you want to stick $100,000 in, you got to have a pretty hefty death benefit because you have to have a lot of life insurance. We could either buy you a hefty death benefit benefit with whole life, that's going to cost a lot, or we could buy a death benefit with something affordable like term, stick the cash in. Once you get the cash in, the cash is in. Then when the term expires, the cash is already in there. [01:18:42] Speaker A: Term expires, the cash is already in there. [01:18:45] Speaker B: It's already in there. Back before the Great Depression, back before the Great Depression, we had wealthy families, families taking 500, $600,000, sticking it into an insurance policy, and they're like, I only want a million of death benefit. I only want to pay 1000 bucks a year. I only want to pay 2000 bucks a year. And the government wasn't able to tax that money because it's life insurance, it's non taxable. So the government now puts a law, a rule on the policy where you have to have a high enough death benefit to support your cash value value. You got to be buying life insurance. You can't buy investments. It's only life insurance. So we have to give you enough life insurance to stick the cash value in. [01:19:33] Speaker A: I mean, you know what? I'm going to be listening to this part over again. I actually listen to these because I'm interviewing people that sometimes they're giving me new information and so I have to hear the information a little bit to fully absorb it. [01:19:45] Speaker B: Yeah, it's just you want to stick cash in, they're going to require you to have a certain high enough death benefit benefit. And we could get you a death benefit by buying more whole life or buying a little bit of term attached. So we, we combine the two and make it happen so that you could stuff cash into your policy and supercharge the policy. Can you see me on the screen when I go like that? [01:20:05] Speaker A: I can. I definitely can. Yes. Yeah, we got it. We got the energy of that. So you're explaining another reason why you would attach the term to it is for the benefit that you just described. [01:20:17] Speaker B: For the cash dump. Would that only allow you want to dump cash? [01:20:21] Speaker A: Does that help soften your premium by adding the term because it's cheaper. So if you could go all out whole, but by softening, softening the hole with the term, it helps decrease your premium but still giving you, giving you that upside at the end. Okay, got it. [01:20:41] Speaker B: Yes, you got it. [01:20:43] Speaker A: I'm going to edit out all of the part that I didn't get it and I'm just going to get it right away now next time. [01:20:48] Speaker B: But it's organic, baby. And I love being organic. So do whatever you want to do. You don't have to edit nothing on my account. [01:20:54] Speaker A: I hear you. [01:20:55] Speaker B: Okay, now this is where life insurance gets sexy. [01:21:01] Speaker A: Sexy life insurance. [01:21:03] Speaker B: Okay. [01:21:03] Speaker A: All right, I'm paying attention. [01:21:05] Speaker B: Do you see how this column reads? $96,000 cash value right now? Can you see how there's a $94,000 loan taken, taken out. [01:21:15] Speaker A: Right, because that's the, that's what you talked about in the very beginning. You said you could take out about 94% of, of your cash value. [01:21:25] Speaker B: 95. [01:21:28] Speaker A: This is, this is a slow rolling process. And, and in fact I'm going to kind of go back to the stock market here. There's an immediate gratification to the stock market. And it's that liquidity aspect that people love. And I love it too. But I'm smart enough to realize, and I think a lot of wealthy people are, is that the liquidity is kind of what doesn't allow you greater gains in the future. It's the whole idea of patience. So by becoming, to a degree illiquid. That's the same thing with the real estate. Like. Like Grant going broke. So always going back to zero. You're always going back to zero. [01:22:08] Speaker B: Now, I will add one more thing. If you want to access your liquid in the stock market market, you can either borrow against it at like. Have you ever done that? Borrowed against your portfolio? [01:22:18] Speaker A: I use margin. [01:22:19] Speaker B: What's the rate? What's the rate? [01:22:21] Speaker A: It was really good. When I first started using it. It was like 2 or 3%, but. But it. The rate changes like it does with all vehicles and investments. And I think the current rate is somewhere around 5 to 7%, maybe 7, 8. It. It's. It's coming back in again, but it's definitely higher than it was initially. [01:22:39] Speaker B: Cool. So when you borrow against your stocks, 7 to 8%. When you borrow against your life insurance. 4.9%. With no. [01:22:49] Speaker A: That. [01:22:49] Speaker B: Repayment terms. [01:22:51] Speaker A: Yes. Okay. With no repayment terms. Whoa, whoa, whoa. No repayment terms. Okay. No repayment terms. Explain. [01:22:58] Speaker B: This shows as if you never pay it back. This shows as if you don't make a single payment for the rest of your life. Life. It's going to Keep growing at 4.9. [01:23:08] Speaker A: Borrowing money from myself. Right. I'm borrowing money from a life insurance. [01:23:14] Speaker B: Company that you now own. So, yeah, from. [01:23:17] Speaker A: I'm a policyholder. Right, You're a policyholder. You own like being a shareholder. I. I really appreciate how you explain that because I think a person thinking through this can understand those things. [01:23:29] Speaker B: Well, because you told me that you're a stock market guy, so I got to explain it like that. That was the fact finding. [01:23:34] Speaker A: Right, right, right, right. It's very smart. [01:23:36] Speaker B: What? Why? How? If you are someone who likes stocks, why? Because they grow. How am I going to explain this to you? I'm going to explain this to you like you're buying stock. [01:23:45] Speaker A: Yeah. And that's really smart. And so for people listening, outside of just the content that we're discussing here, if you have no interest or you already have life insurance or. I don't think you would have made it this far if you have absolutely no interest. But like I prefaced in the beginning, there's a sales component happening here. So even if you're just watching this, and I think maybe when I do, when I do the description on the podcast and come up with some sexy title to actually get people to listen, I think that aspect of it should be highlighted is the sexy part right here. [01:24:20] Speaker B: So this shows as if you never pay it back because there are no repayment terms. Now you should pay it back because if you opened up a bank and people started taking loans from it and never paid it back, you wouldn't do that. [01:24:33] Speaker A: That's how I look at it. I'm like, I don't see why I would want to do that. And it kind of goes back to me just not liking debt. So part of me taking the loan on the balance. There's two aspect, two rubs for me. And I would imagine anyone that you talk to, the one rub is we never want to spend any money even though we know we have to. And the other rub is I don't want to borrow any money at any interest because I just don't like borrowing money. So there's those two hurdles for me personally, like when you say, have you heard enough to make a decision? I know I'm going to be wrestling with those two things. Things in terms of deciding whether or not I want to do this. [01:25:13] Speaker B: I got you. Now I'm going to ask you, what would any billionaire with a B say about debt? [01:25:21] Speaker A: They. Billionaires have debt. So one of the competitors to the person that we mentioned enough times in here, I don't need to mention his name again, said that they are $750 million in debt. Like, Robert Kiyosaki is another big name in the real estate game, and he's got all kinds of vehicles and things he talks about. And there's a YouTube video that came out within the last couple months, and it was this one guy who I can't. I just can't remember his name. And then. Which is. There you go. Marketing, Right? I know one guy's name. I don't remember the other guy's name, but I like him. I still watch his content. He was saying how the two of them own billions of dollars of real estate and they also have billions of dollars of debt. I know him personally, said $750 million of debt, and he was cool with it. He's just chill. [01:26:09] Speaker B: Yeah. So I think that you're not liking debt. I don't think that that's even an. An objection. I think that's more of a complaint where it's like, I'm with you. Nobody likes debt, man. But billionaires say that you need debt. So moving on. Right. [01:26:25] Speaker A: All right, so. So here when I'm thinking about this, if I'm borrowing money from myself, if going to borrow money for any reason. So let. Let's use the stock analogy. If I borrow on margin, it's not like I'm borrowing margin to go buy a car. I'm borrowing margin to buy more stock to. If I think if an investment's. If I'm borrowing it, 5%, whatever I'm putting that money into, I want to. To. I expect it to give me more than 5%. So what you do, this goes for just anybody listening. But this is one of the things I'm thinking through in my head is like, okay, if I borrow this money, where am I allocating the money that I would be borrowing? So that's how I would think about it. Okay. [01:27:08] Speaker B: And one thing I want to expand your mind a little bit for is you said something like a car. You would never need to borrow money for a car. You know, you spoke to me a little bit about your personal situation. You would never need to borrow money for a car. You could probably buy cars, cash. But there are people out there that are stuck paying 7, 8, 9% interest to car dealership dealerships. When, you know, say you want to buy a car for 20 grand and all you got is 50 grand, and you don't want to part where you're 20 grand. You use your life insurance policy to buy the car, and then you pay yourself back on a schedule. [01:27:41] Speaker A: Right. That's very interesting. And that's kind of where the concept of borrowing from yourself comes in. [01:27:47] Speaker B: And that's. And that's how you look at it on, like a lower income level. Just an. Just an everyday guy who needs to buy his daughter a car for 20 grand, and he's got 50 grand in the bank and he's nervous because his daughter needs a car. He's got 50 grand in the bank and he's about to lose 40% of his money. [01:28:07] Speaker A: Right. [01:28:08] Speaker B: Or he could put himself in debt to a car dealership. [01:28:10] Speaker A: Expensive cars are expensive, Even basic cars now. [01:28:14] Speaker B: Yeah. In the other scenario, he could use his life insurance policy to buy the car, and then his daughter could pay him back on a schedule when she gets off her feet. [01:28:25] Speaker A: Interesting. [01:28:26] Speaker B: That's the scenario your everyday family man. [01:28:28] Speaker A: Sure, sure. I get the scenarios. That makes sense to me. [01:28:31] Speaker B: Cool. But in your scenario, it's like, let's make buku bucks with this. Cool. [01:28:34] Speaker A: Yeah. Right. [01:28:34] Speaker B: So you See how the loan never gets paid off and it keeps compounding at 4.9%. This is your worst nightmare. My God. You never paid it off. [01:28:43] Speaker A: Night. That's my worst nightmare. Where you're like, you don't pay it off. And I'm like, it just compounds and eats away anything. But. Okay, I'm watching. I feel like I know where you're going with this. So I'm. I want to see. Yeah, yeah. [01:28:54] Speaker B: All right. So while this is compounding and you're being a bad boy, not paying yourself back. [01:28:59] Speaker A: Right. [01:28:59] Speaker B: It doesn't pop up on any sort of credit report, and it doesn't pop up as debt. [01:29:03] Speaker A: Okay, that is very interesting. And actually, margin works the same way. It doesn't show up on your report. So it's. Yeah, because you're pledging. [01:29:11] Speaker B: You're pledging your money. They don't need your credit. You're pledging your money. You're pledging your. Your stuff. They don't need your vehicle. You're pledging an asset. You can't pledge your bank account, but you could pledge your life insurance policy. Okay. And you could pledge your. You could pledge your brokerage account, but if it goes down in value while you're pledging it, that's a difficult situation. This is the one thing that you could pledge, that you could leverage that'll never go down in value. All right, now, you'll see on the right hand side, this is your remaining borrowing power. All right? So this is where I compare life insurance to a starfish. I get a little bit funny here. You chop an army off, and 14 years later, it grows itself back. So when you said that the policy is eating itself. No, no, no, no, no. The policy is feeding itself. [01:29:56] Speaker A: I'm listening. [01:29:58] Speaker B: So you grow your Money back in 14 years if you act like a bad boy and don't pay it back. [01:30:03] Speaker A: So it's almost like you're borrowing, and then in the end. End, whatever you're borrowing is going to be deducted from your policy. So it's like, I don't want to pay this thing off until I die. Oh, man, that reminds me what I heard. And this fits right into that, which is wealthy people, they buy assets, they borrow, and then they die. Is that where this kind of mentality. Does that apply to the. This. [01:30:36] Speaker B: It's such a versatile thing that, like, when you're. When you're 72 years old, 80 years old, you got a couple of million dollars in here, you start taking out 200 grand a year of completely tax free income and then you die and you don't worry about paying it back. You could use this as a retirement plan. When you're younger, you want to use it as a vehicle to invest in that things. Not the investment, the car that you use to drive to the investment. But when you're older, you could use this just to retire on and then die. Because most people have a K or a Simple ira and then when they get older and they start pulling money out, they got to pay tax. This is completely tax free. And anytime you leverage something or borrow against or take out a loan, it's not income, it's debt. [01:31:31] Speaker A: I see that. I see it. We're kind of hitting a hard stop here. I really appreciate you taking the time to walk me through this. You're going to have me outside so people listening. Is he like, is he going to do this or is he not going to do this? I'll have to let you know. And any post edit that I do how this, how this played out. Because 100% I'm going to thank Jared for being here. I always do a post conversation. So I'm not done with Jared and I have a few episodes. I have back episodes of this because that investment that I was telling you. [01:32:07] Speaker B: This is going to be with my friend. [01:32:09] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. So that investment that I have with my friend, there's an episode for that. There's that. There's the real estate investment. There's an episode for that. There's like a lot of things. Things that I am genuinely entertaining. And so we're going to see what's going to happen with all of these. But I'm going to thank Jerry for being here. I hope that the listener got insight and value from this process, whether it's regards to the sales process or whether it's regards to life insurance in general and whole life in particular. And this whole strategy of infinite banking is the term. So if you're going to be starting a Google stuff and look at stuff and get interested. And even before the end of that, this was an opportunity for Jared to give his presentation. And if you found interest in this, you should reach out to him because he genuinely knows what he's talking about. So you definitely want to talk to somebody that's knowledgeable in what they're presenting. And Jared is that guy Jared from li.com. in a future episode, I'll have Jared come back on and we'll do like a post how things played out and we'll leave that as a teaser. So thank you all for listening to this episode of the Money Adjustment and I'll see you on the next one. Thank you for watching this episode of the Money Adjustment. If you want more like comment and subscribe, you can follow me on X ark Kramer until the next episode. Stay healthy and wealthy.